Principles of Pro Style Offenses

[TXHusker05]

Don't feel bad. I built an all-pistol one back book last night in Madden 16 and got hammered by the CPU. How does 130 yards rushing and 190 yards passing sound? Blah...

I'm almost to the point of pulling a Nick Saban and joining the herd of spread clones.

130 rushing and 190 passing sounds just like the NFL.

I was actually thinking about doing the reverse, maybe run my under center Osborne offense with the ex-QB HB moved to FB since he has some block ratings. Put the blocking TE at FB2 that way I could go jumbo package and move people around. I mainly just want to run FB Dive though, not sure I care about the rest of it.

The other idea I had was just an Air Force style offense where I dabble in a bit of everything. I know I need to be running and grinding it out. Just don't know if that means grind it out from under center sets or grind it out with spread option.

 

[JSU Zack]

Well, I was moving the ball on @NavyHog and disconnected.

 

[NavyHog]

Well, I was moving the ball on @NavyHog and disconnected.

You moved the ball all night. That FB you had at HB had over 100 yards and I swear 60 of it was after contact. It was weird seeing a left-handed QB, shouldn't make a difference, but I bet my completion percentage would be around 40% with a southpaw.

GG.

 

[LEGEND]

You moved the ball all night. That FB you had at HB had over 100 yards and I swear 60 of it was after contact. It was weird seeing a left-handed QB, shouldn't make a difference, but I bet my completion percentage would be around 40% with a southpaw.

GG.

At one time I made all my Qb's left handed.. I'm thinking of doing this again.

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[JSU Zack]

You moved the ball all night. That FB you had at HB had over 100 yards and I swear 60 of it was after contact. It was weird seeing a left-handed QB, shouldn't make a difference, but I bet my completion percentage would be around 40% with a southpaw.

GG.

You adjusted to my empty sets. I have my audibles setup exactly the way I need them. Made countering your adjustments relatively easy, but I could block that well.

Would enjoy a lab to try a few other things out when you have time. I'm curious f there is any way to counter your aggressive FS.

 

[NavyHog]

You adjusted to my empty sets. I have my audibles setup exactly the way I need them. Made countering your adjustments relatively easy, but I could block that well.

Would enjoy a lab to try a few other things out when you have time. I'm curious f there is any way to counter your aggressive FS.

Well when you went play action and threw to a wide open WR on fly pattern with no one within 15 yards was a good counter. I usually get myself in more trouble trying to clean up things with my FS, but last night I tackled well.

 

[fanoftgame]

You adjusted to my empty sets. I have my audibles setup exactly the way I need them. Made countering your adjustments relatively easy, but I could block that well.

Would enjoy a lab to try a few other things out when you have time. I'm curious f there is any way to counter your aggressive FS.

I didn't see wut he is running obviously but If he was running a robber type look out of the cover 3 alignment.


The first Thing you want to do is go single back, and preferably have at least one slot in the game.

You want to look at this defense as inverted tampa two. He is the MLb in the Tampa 2(just faster) like in the tampa 2 a big weakness is the vacated hole in front of the mlb because he is bailing to cover the vertical seam. Test that first see how he reacts to that. Most will play the verts and leave middle wide open. Tbh I feel its harder to stop this combo than the four verts for this defense.

Next you have to know if its cover 3 and he is manually coverting it to 2 robber or its really cover 2 robber. In ncaa its most likely cover 3 converted. This is important because it will affect how the underneath coverage plays. In cover3 you can still attack the flats because the linebackers are progrmmed to give that up in this coverage. In true cover 2 robber the middle will be more open to crossers.


A combo you really should get alot of use out of is the vert, corner, qucik out to the sidline. He is just outleveraged from his fs position to cover the corner and his cb's will likely be shaded to the middle of field. If he does come over and over plays it by alignment look for the backside wr coming across the middle(not really deep middle but that vacated tampa 2 mlb linebacker position).

Lastly, 4 verts. This one of the reasons you want to be in a spread or single back formation. You want the constant threat of two vertical seams as far apart as possible for him to deal with. Also unless he is really misaligned if possible always use play action with 4 verts. I have seen alot of users defend for verts out of essentially 3 deep but only with help by the underneath coverage. If the underneath doesnt carry the seams as long as your spread it going to be tough to me make a play even with great users. Playaction freezes the underneath stopping/limiting their ablity to carry.

As far as running the it depends how agressive he is. I would sill run your standard stuff(single high run game) but If they are really active it my be tough sledding until you open him up in the passing game. Pay attention to pesonnel and see if you get some mismatch in the run game with a te on a secoundary defender. Or if he is stubborn put speedsters in the slot and play 4 verts and corner routes until he changes.

Remember you need to run even if its not working for the the playaction to hold underneath coverage.


This is a tough d in this game but its manageble. Hope some of this helps.




Sidenote, you may not even be talking about this type of defense I just felt like giving some ideas I have seen in ncaa and madden recently.

 

[JSU Zack]

Yeah, I basically used the gameplan above. The problem was my big hitters didn't work out except for the PA Cross out of ace spread. That play was like Kiffin calling his shot. Never done that against a user before. Felt great.

 

[PaHsFootballRules]

@JSU Zack

How's the write-up coming along?

 

[JSU Zack]

@JSU Zack

How's the write-up coming along?

It's coming. Working on the call sheet now.

 

[PaHsFootballRules]

It's coming. Working on the call sheet now.

Wow sounds indepth

 

[TXHusker05]

You moved the ball all night. That FB you had at HB had over 100 yards and I swear 60 of it was after contact. It was weird seeing a left-handed QB, shouldn't make a difference, but I bet my completion percentage would be around 40% with a southpaw.

GG.

At one time I made all my Qb's left handed.. I'm thinking of doing this again.

Sent from my LG-D850 using Tapatalk

Left handed QBs are shockingly effective. When I had a more run oriented QB, I loved making him lefty because the majority of my QB run plays like Jet/Wildcat/Q Power went to the right and I ended up on the right hash more often than not. Then I would be able to play action/boot/sprintout back towards the wide (left) side of the field which was perfect for the lefty passer.

I actually thought about going back to that for my backup QB this year since he's more of a runner but decided against it because I've been in the Pistol and most PA in the Pistol are off of Dive to the QB's right. A lefty QB would have to flip around and it caused chaos.

 

[PaHsFootballRules]

I have two backs that I would like to get over 1,000 yards each and split their carries 50/50 or 60/40. What are you guys doing with a crowded backfield: form subs, auto subs (what are your settings), designated formations, hb at wr packages, etc? Thanks

 

[JSU Zack]

I have two backs that I would like to get over 1,000 yards each and split their carries 50/50 or 60/40. What are you guys doing with a crowded backfield: form subs, auto subs (what are your settings), designated formations, hb at wr packages, etc? Thanks

Use split backs & dual HB formations subs in the I to split carries. Alternatively, manually sub them in like the NFL. If you do too much to change your overall scheme, it's not worth it; just sub the guy in to get him touches. Now, if the 2nd guy is a Reggie Bush type, I would definitely sub him in at WR to put him in space, but those guys are rare.

 

[Craig7835]

I went back time by playing my NCAA 2010 game on PS2. My Pro Style Offense had a mix of formation consisting of 2 Ace & 2 Pistol formations,3 I-Forms & 5 Shotgun formations.The Pistol was about jackshit in that game but I-Form/Tight had my favorite coverage beater,the PA Rollout in which the running back ran a wheel route.I would motion him to the left & before he sets,I would hike the ball & it was always a 99% chance that RB would beat his man. I wish they brough this route back in the later in NCAA games though

 

[TXHusker05]

I have two backs that I would like to get over 1,000 yards each and split their carries 50/50 or 60/40. What are you guys doing with a crowded backfield: form subs, auto subs (what are your settings), designated formations, hb at wr packages, etc? Thanks

I play two backs in a majority of my formations this season, a flex back (F) and a more traditional runner (T). I have a handful of normal two back formations, Split Offset being my favorite but most of the time I utilize a combination of packages and formation subs to get the second back on the field. Some examples:

Pistol Twin TE Slot

----X---------------------T-G-C-G-T-TE--------------
----------------Z------------------------F------------
--------------------------------Q----------------------
---------------------------------------------------------
--------------------------------T----------------------

That's probably my base formation, I run Strong Power, Counter, Stretch and Lead Option and then I have two Pistol H Twins audibles. Triple Option Left and Right. That lets me quick motion the F back into the backfield to serve as a dive back or pitch back on option. I find that I have a ton of success with that set of plays.

Pistol Weak Slot

----X-------------T-G-C-G-T------------------Z----
----------------------------------------F------------
-------------------FB--Q---------------------------
-----------------------------------------------------
------------------------T----------------------------

I have another series out of this where I come out in Lead Option. If no one covers the F-back/slot WR, I will quick PA audible to bubble screen and throw it out there. That's an easy 5+ yards. If someone covers him and I get two high, I'll just run the lead option as called. If the defense drops a safety (or is in 425/335), I have two Pistol Full House audibles where the F-back/slot comes in pseudo Jet motion into the backfield to run either Off Tackle (essentially Jet Sweep) and Triple Option Wk where he becomes to pitch back.

I do similar things out of Gun 4WR Trio (Offset). Put the F-back in the inner most slot, with the TE as the middle slot. If no one covers him, I'll just quick check and throw bubble. If I get two high, I'll run inside zone/read. If I get a safety dropped down, I have Split Offset Triple Option as my 5th audible and I can motion the F into the backfield and use him as a dive back.

I do similar stuff in under center Weak Normal I (Over), where I only have two plays. Fly Sweep and Fk Fly Dive.

------WR-------------T-T-G-C-G-T----------------
------------------------------Q-----------------F---
-------------------------FB-------------------------
------------------------------T----------------------

Extra OL formation subbed at the ineligible TE spot, FB or TE at FB. I'll call Fly Sweep in the huddle. If I have numbers playside, I'll just run it with my F-back running Fly. If I don't, I'll quick run audible to Fk Fly Dive and hand it to the tailback.

In my three Strong I formations, I only run FB Dive, HB Toss and PA FB. I put my power back at FB, my F-Back at HB. Call FB Dive in the huddle, if it is there, take it. If there is no overhang player to the strong side, I'll quick run audible to HB Toss to get my F-back in space. If I have a really fast WR, I'll even sub him in at HB in Strong.

Hopefully that gives you some ideas. It works for me, but I can imagine a lot of people wouldn't want to commit a bunch of audibles like I do. I play around with formation subs and packages quite a bit in order to break formation tendencies out of the huddle and to get different players in space. If I don't have the tailbacks to run something like that, I'll sub receivers, fullbacks or even tight ends into those positions.

 

[LEGEND]

Ran into an issue I hadn't seen since NCAA 12. My game got a crack in it... So I downloaded it from online. This is the first game I've done this with.

Everything seemed to be the same as playing from the disc. That is until last night. I'm Miami in this OD and I had to play FSU again but for the ACC championship.

I'd already blown them out during the 1st game. This game was totally different! I literally could not do anything against the cpu! On every offensive snap my offensive line did that turn and run with the defender animation. Never once attempting to raise hands to block.

I had to Sprint out on every pass attempt to have a shot of attempting a pass. When I tried to run same animation and my back trampled in the back field. When I did manage to get off a pass or run... It was either a Int or drop! If not then it was a fumble by the receiver or RB.

I started watching the replays and every route was mirrored. You could see the players body actually spin or move against their actual movements. If the receiver cut left and defender was headed right.... You could see them change direction and going left while body was still turned to the right. This happened on every route even shake routes.

I can't think of any reason why the game played like this.... other than it being the downloaded version? I'm just curious... any of you have the downloaded version and experienced game play like this?

It was the strangest game play I've ever seen. The defenders where in man but would play like zone and vice versa. I really can't explain all that happened. The only thing that saved me was I went to pistol and started running read option. That seemed to loosen the cpu up!

I was then able to mix in some shotgun read and Qb wrap runs. I managed to score with 12 seconds left in the fourth quarter to pull out a 7-6 victory. Even that came down to the actual final :01 second! As the cpu managed to throw several 80 yd passes... that I dropped for the Int, but prevented the TD.

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[TXHusker05]

Ran into an issue I hadn't seen since NCAA 12. My game got a crack in it... So I downloaded it from online. This is the first game I've done this with.

Everything seemed to be the same as playing from the disc. That is until last night. I'm Miami in this OD and I had to play FSU again but for the ACC championship.

I'd already blown them out during the 1st game. This game was totally different! I literally could not do anything against the cpu! On every offensive snap my offensive line did that turn and run with the defender animation. Never once attempting to raise hands to block.

I had to Sprint out on every pass attempt to have a shot of attempting a pass. When I tried to run same animation and my back trampled in the back field. When I did manage to get off a pass or run... It was either a Int or drop! If not then it was a fumble by the receiver or RB.

I started watching the replays and every route was mirrored. You could see the players body actually spin or move against their actual movements. If the receiver cut left and defender was headed right.... You could see them change direction and going left while body was still turned to the right. This happened on every route even shake routes.

I can't think of any reason why the game played like this.... other than it being the downloaded version? I'm just curious... any of you have the downloaded version and experienced game play like this?

It was the strangest game play I've ever seen. The defenders where in man but would play like zone and vice versa. I really can't explain all that happened. The only thing that saved me was I went to pistol and started running read option. That seemed to loosen the cpu up!

I was then able to mix in some shotgun read and Qb wrap runs. I managed to score with 12 seconds left in the fourth quarter to pull out a 7-6 victory. Even that came down to the actual final :01 second! As the cpu managed to throw several 80 yd passes... that I dropped for the Int, but prevented the TD.

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Out of curiosity, were you playing a CPU opponent that had a coach with upgrades? That sounds very similar to games where you face a maxed out coach who has the absurdly overpowered upgrades and the game just turns into a clusterfuck. OL gets overpowered, DBs run routes before the WRs do, CPU LBs morph laterally to magically catch up on perimeter runs.

There wouldn't be any difference between the two games, it sounds like you got CPU coach upgraded.

 

[LEGEND]

Out of curiosity, were you playing a CPU opponent that had a coach with upgrades? That sounds very similar to games where you face a maxed out coach who has the absurdly overpowered upgrades and the game just turns into a clusterfuck. OL gets overpowered, DBs run routes before the WRs do, CPU LBs morph laterally to magically catch up on perimeter runs.

There wouldn't be any difference between the two games, it sounds like you got CPU coach upgraded.

It was actually a user team that coach is maxed out... He was on auto pilot for both games. I had never experienced that before... But they did everything you mentioned.

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[TXHusker05]

It was actually a user team that coach is maxed out... He was on auto pilot for both games. I had never experienced that before... But they did everything you mentioned.

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If the coach is maxed out with upgrades, that is exactly what happened. Those two couple rows of HC upgrades are devastating when you play the CPU. It is basically CPU cheat mode.

 

[TXHusker05]

Watching Stanford just punch UCLA in the face over and over again with 6-7 OL and multiple FB/TE is awesome. If I had the personnel to make it work, I would absolutely try running something like that. I think that would be enough of a change of pace in OD play to work, even without running option. That's something absolutely no one runs and you'd like to think you could get 3-4 a pop control the clock and ball.

Unfortunately, I am barely going to have enough offensive linemen to put 5 on the field which is problem enough in my normal offense. I will have two very good young tackles, but low 70s players behind each. My 97 OVR RG graduates and I'm playing a backup center at LG this year. The backup center will be around 88-89 OVR but he has to start at center to replace a graduating 93 OVR C. That leaves essentially two players to start at the two guard spots, a third backup center who was my third string TE this year and the only other guard on my roster, who will be 79-80 OVR.

That is all I've got. 5 OL. I should sign a 76 OVR FR and 2 OL 71 and 69 OVR just for depth. I won't even have a 2nd TE on my roster, just 1 TE. No FB. I suppose putting low to mid 70s OL on the field as extra OL is better than putting bad TEs or no TEs. My two backup tackles next year both have mid-70s RBK. Even awful OVR offensive linemen have significantly better block ratings than most CPU generated TEs.

How great would it be to line up with 7 OL and just punch people in the face over and over? Might have to look into it since there is no damn way I'm going to risk throwing the ball in that OD (unless we switch to QBA 10, in which case, I'm going to a YOLO Bomb* offense).

* - Registered trademark of Taylor Martinez.

 

[TXHusker05]

It sounds like we are going to QBA 10 for sure next season which is going to be chaos. Leaves me with a dilemma. Run a slow, methodical ball control offense to milk clock, shorten the game and limit my opponent's possessions. Or run a YOLO Raid offense and just turn everything into a shootout. I have the personnel to do both. I really, really want to run a slow methodical ball control offense because I think it would be rather unique to the OD, but I just know that I'll go 3 & Out one drive in the game and it'll snowball on me with no way to keep up. That's exactly what got me out of my Osborne offense in OD play, I'd fall behind schedule one down or one drive and end up clawing all game just to come back from that. I do think my defense is better here than others I've had though.

Initial instinct is multiple option. I think it rides the line between slow methodical ball control but with more of an ability for explosive runs than a power pro offense would. Have to see how the class shakes out though. At least I know I can really do anything and not be weighed down by the threat of CPU shenanigans with QBA set at 5.

Was browsing the InterTubes and found this, really interesting multiple option offense with some unique power elements (lead, counter trap and a g scheme). I think I could pull off most of that, it isn't that far off from what Air Force does.



After looking at my one and only TE on roster, I think I could let him play double duty as a FB/TE. He is an 85 OVR TE, which is where I would leave him. 78 SPD, 77 STR, 80 ACC, 59 AGI. Mid-80s catch ratings, upper 70s block ratings, 87 BTK, 89 TRK, 70 CAR. Sounds like he can be a bowling ball FB. I think that will be my plan.

 

[LEGEND]

If the coach is maxed out with upgrades, that is exactly what happened. Those two couple rows of HC upgrades are devastating when you play the CPU. It is basically CPU cheat mode.

Thinking back... We played our first match up! I was thinking he had been on auto. But we were both undefeated. So that's why I didn't experience it in earlier game against FSU!

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[JSU Zack]

@TXHusker05 Go check out "the Multiple Wishbone" on YouTube. A HS runs it, and it's a mix of standard bone and moving around the A backs to create West Coast formations (Strong twins, bunch, etc.). They run midline out of what looks like 11 personnel, but it's a FB. Drool.

 

[LEGEND]

@TXHusker05 Go check out "the Multiple Wishbone" on YouTube. A HS runs it, and it's a mix of standard bone and moving around the A backs to create West Coast formations (Strong twins, bunch, etc.). They run midline out of what looks like 11 personnel, but it's a FB. Drool.

This is what the run heavy playbook use to offer! It was the only playbook I'd ever played with until they removed it! I really loved that playbook...

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[PaHsFootballRules]

You guys should check out the double dive stuff on YouTube. I'll post some stuff later. It's better than the option imo and I will explain later once the kids are in bed and PSU isn't embarrassing themselves (hopefully)

 

[TXHusker05]

@TXHusker05 Go check out "the Multiple Wishbone" on YouTube. A HS runs it, and it's a mix of standard bone and moving around the A backs to create West Coast formations (Strong twins, bunch, etc.). They run midline out of what looks like 11 personnel, but it's a FB. Drool.

FB is going to be a tough position for me this year because it'll either be a non-blocking HB or a non-running TE. My TE can run just enough and has great BTK/TRK ratings to be a threat, but I don't know how much of one.

I was thinking about some Ace, I, Maryland I, Power I, Flexbone plus Offset Gun Option. Mainly 2-3 backs. Alternate between my TE at FB and a HB at FB. I may do some Strong I stuff because I love the FB Dive out of that, it hits the backside A gap and depending on the front you can gash the defense for 5 yards before he is even touched. Even in my Spread I offenses I have Strong I to run FB Dive and Toss.

I just get the feeling if I put that many formation groupings in a playbook that it is going to be a jumbled mess. I like having my formations in a certain order, usually Ace, I, Maryland I, Power I, Flexbone, Gun, Goal Line left to right. In my Spread I it is Ace, Strong I, Weak I, Pistol, Gun, Wildcat, Goal Line Heavy. It took a lot of trial and error getting the formation orders right, if I start adding even more I think it'll be a mess.

Typically Ace will always be first, but the order in which you add a formation and which formation (what personnel grouping it is) impacts how the formation group will be ordered. For my Spread-I, using Auburn's base playbook, I had to remove every formation except Shotgun F Wing Over and Wildcat Spread Flex. Then I added them back as Ace, Strong I Twins, Weak Twin TE, Pistol Jumbo Z. Then once the formation groupings were ordered right, I would go in and add the formations I really wanted (Weak Normal for example) and then delete Weak Twin TE. I think, think, the pattern is the heavier the personnel grouping, the farther back in the book it goes... BUT that goes haywire if there are 3 backs because when I add Wishbone for example, it goes to the front between Ace and Strong.

Basically it is a clusterfuck and I like having a set order to things. I suppose I could just deal with whatever order, but then it gets tough to find things when you go tempo. I've done this in that order for so many games now that I can find formations with my eyes closed.

 

[PSUEagle]

I just get the feeling if I put that many formation groupings in a playbook that it is going to be a jumbled mess. I like having my formations in a certain order, usually Ace, I, Maryland I, Power I, Flexbone, Gun, Goal Line left to right. In my Spread I it is Ace, Strong I, Weak I, Pistol, Gun, Wildcat, Goal Line Heavy. It took a lot of trial and error getting the formation orders right, if I start adding even more I think it'll be a mess.

I figured a lot of this stuff out through trial and error over years.

-If you delete all of your Ace stuff and add "Y-Trips" first, it will always go first order wise.
-Deleting all of the Gun stuff at the end and adding "Ace" will usually make shotgun go last
-Adding in Pistol last with "Full House" as your first formation will usually slot it in between whatever I sets you have and the gun, which is perfect for me whenever I want that (rare these days)

Basically, if you want a Pro style type playbook I'd recommend using SDSU as your base: it'll keep all of the I/Strong/Weak sets in logical order. Play around with the Flexbone/Maryland I stuff to get it where you want, and then do the following: add in Ace Y-Trips and then Gun Ace at the end (have also done Gun Cluster HB Str when Ace doesn't work). Back out and save. And then just add sets that you actually want first (like say Ace Big) and then delete the placeholder (Ace Y-Trips).

Make sense?

 

[TXHusker05]

I figured a lot of this stuff out through trial and error over years.

-If you delete all of your Ace stuff and add "Y-Trips" first, it will always go first order wise.
-Deleting all of the Gun stuff at the end and adding "Ace" will usually make shotgun go last
-Adding in Pistol last with "Full House" as your first formation will usually slot it in between whatever I sets you have and the gun, which is perfect for me whenever I want that (rare these days)

Basically, if you want a Pro style type playbook I'd recommend using SDSU as your base: it'll keep all of the I/Strong/Weak sets in logical order. Play around with the Flexbone/Maryland I stuff to get it where you want, and then do the following: add in Ace Y-Trips and then Gun Ace at the end (have also done Gun Cluster HB Str when Ace doesn't work). Back out and save. And then just add sets that you actually want first (like say Ace Big) and then delete the placeholder (Ace Y-Trips).

Make sense?

It does, I typically add Ace Big, which has always gone first for me. In my Husker Power Osborne offense playbook, I got things perfect. Ace, I, Maryland I, Power I, Flexbone, Shotgun, Goal Line. That took a lot of trial and error to get right, especially with Flexbone which constantly wanted to move between I and Maryland I. I'll probably just re-appropriate that book for any multiple option offense I create.

I'm getting more and more excited to try this TE at FB because of those BTK and TRK ratings. Have some formations where he stays at TE, then a few others where he moves into FB and is still a run threat. Even with QBA at 10 now I think I'm just going to roll with a multiple option. I think QBA 10 will make it easier to throw from under center, which is something I've historically struggled with. I know you have success with it, I've never known how. Anytime I throw under center it turns into a clusterfuck.

 

[PSUEagle]

It does, I typically add Ace Big, which has always gone first for me. In my Husker Power Osborne offense playbook, I got things perfect. Ace, I, Maryland I, Power I, Flexbone, Shotgun, Goal Line. That took a lot of trial and error to get right, especially with Flexbone which constantly wanted to move between I and Maryland I. I'll probably just re-appropriate that book for any multiple option offense I create.

I'm getting more and more excited to try this TE at FB because of those BTK and TRK ratings. Have some formations where he stays at TE, then a few others where he moves into FB and is still a run threat. Even with QBA at 10 now I think I'm just going to roll with a multiple option. I think QBA 10 will make it easier to throw from under center, which is something I've historically struggled with. I know you have success with it, I've never known how. Anytime I throw under center it turns into a clusterfuck.

I got mine a year and a half ago to setup exactly how I wanted, which was pretty cool.

Ace
Empty
I
Split
Strong
Weak
Gun

Really want to do one where I junk Split and Weak and have Wishbone and Pistol between Empty and Gun, but can't figure it out and don't have the patience to spend hours on a project like that.

As for the bolded, it's like anything else in the passing game: if you don't have an answer for blitz 0 (especially bump and run) you shouldn't be running it. On any passing play I run I have a plan for what receiver(s) is getting the ball once I read all out pressure. For me it's usually a corner route, stem dig, stem post, or circus route (those "C" routes the WR's run in the Corner Strike plays). Or I have a TE running a corner, post, or option somewhere: he can't get bumped so I can usually spit the ball out to him before I'm in trouble.

Another thing is let the autodrop play out fully: it gets you deeper quicker than you can manually and it buys you time to read the defense. In my case I run a lot of "combo" plays where I work one side of the field vs. certain coverages while the other side is for a different set of coverages. So I read the safeties for any rotation and go from there.

Finally, make sure you work the quick game a lot. Whenever I'm in any kind of Slot or Trips look (often) I'll HR #2 or #3 (whichever is appropriate) to a short hitch and make a now throw if they're uncovered. Also really like using Slant/Flat combined with Double Slants along with Stick under center: they're effective against almost any coverage and are easy to read.

 

[JSU Zack]

Also look at Hawaii if you want a good base. It follows this order:
Ace
I
Strong
Weak
Gun

I'm working out the kinks of an old school WCO playbook to unleash on the Powerhouse OD. Zone running game. Short passes. PA Bombs.

 

[TXHusker05]

I got mine a year and a half ago to setup exactly how I wanted, which was pretty cool.

Ace
Empty
I
Split
Strong
Weak
Gun

Really want to do one where I junk Split and Weak and have Wishbone and Pistol between Empty and Gun, but can't figure it out and don't have the patience to spend hours on a project like that.

As for the bolded, it's like anything else in the passing game: if you don't have an answer for blitz 0 (especially bump and run) you shouldn't be running it. On any passing play I run I have a plan for what receiver(s) is getting the ball once I read all out pressure. For me it's usually a corner route, stem dig, stem post, or circus route (those "C" routes the WR's run in the Corner Strike plays). Or I have a TE running a corner, post, or option somewhere: he can't get bumped so I can usually spit the ball out to him before I'm in trouble.

Another thing is let the autodrop play out fully: it gets you deeper quicker than you can manually and it buys you time to read the defense. In my case I run a lot of "combo" plays where I work one side of the field vs. certain coverages while the other side is for a different set of coverages. So I read the safeties for any rotation and go from there.

Finally, make sure you work the quick game a lot. Whenever I'm in any kind of Slot or Trips look (often) I'll HR #2 or #3 (whichever is appropriate) to a short hitch and make a now throw if they're uncovered. Also really like using Slant/Flat combined with Double Slants along with Stick under center: they're effective against almost any coverage and are easy to read.

I think the last two paragraphs are good thoughts. In under center, I get incredibly impatient and throw before the drop back finishes and I end up throwing off my back foot. That's typically because of pressure but also because the routes seem to time up a bit differently compared to what I'm used to in the gun. In Pistol/Gun, I do a quick manual 1-2 step drop and throw.

I hot route #2/3 to a short hitch and throw now from time to time in my offense. It is something I need to do more because the middle slot when I go 3x1 is rarely covered. That's one of those things I remember I like doing mid-game and then do it a bunch and then I forget all about it for 3 games. That's exactly the type of thing I need more of in my offense too, the ability to get the ball to the perimeter quick.

 

[PaHsFootballRules]

@JSUZack

How's the write up coming along?

 

[JSU Zack]

@JSUZack

How's the write up coming along?

Lol. It's not at the moment. I ditched it for the air raid, but most of my stuff was a 11 personnel version of Leach's Air Raid with Erickson's running philosophy. I can extrapolate on that if you'd like.

 

[LEGEND]

Lol. It's not at the moment. I ditched it for the air raid, but most of my stuff was a 11 personnel version of Leach's Air Raid with Erickson's running philosophy. I can extrapolate on that if you'd like.

Please do!

Sent from my LG-D850 using Tapatalk

 

[JSU Zack]

I decided to go ahead and finish the abridged (1800 words) version of my offense. Included in the write-up is my overarching philosophy, explanations of specific plays, and the formations I use. There's a full list of concepts I consider part of my offense as well.

Explanations of secondary plays, specific formations, and a call sheet can be made by request as a follow up.

http://zackwhiteit.com/2015/11/03/the-pro-spread-offense/

I'm also putting a link in the OP.

 

[PaHsFootballRules]

I decided to go ahead and finish the abridged (1800 words) version of my offense. Included in the write-up is my overarching philosophy, explanations of specific plays, and the formations I use. There's a full list of concepts I consider part of my offense as well.

Explanations of secondary plays, specific formations, and a call sheet can be made by request as a follow up.

http://zackwhiteit.com/2015/11/03/the-pro-spread-offense/

I'm also putting a link in the OP.

Awesome!

 

[nofx94]

It is pretty terrific.

When creating a multiple-formation pro style offense with one back as your base, do you mirror your ace sets in pistol and shotgun or do you use personnel setups that aren't already present in your ace sets?

I ask because I'm thinking to use some permutation of Spurrier and Dickerson ideas for my base ace stuff but explore different concepts from the gun and the pistol so that things aren't too vanilla, as well as the I and I-offsets for power running and change ups.

I'm just a huge fan of the I but the ace spread stuff also calls to me. Lol. While at the same time I don't want to have an unrealistically overdeveloped playbook, for my sim sensibilities and my own peace of mind in play calling.

Enviado desde mi XT1064 mediante Tapatalk

 

[LEGEND]

I don't know what my issue is with play calling! I see what defense is doing and I know what I need to do... Yet, I don't do it!

It's like I go into some tunnel vision with my play calling. I have the plays but I'm not using them to attack a defense like I should.

Sent from my LG-D850 using Tapatalk

 

[JSU Zack]

It is pretty terrific.

When creating a multiple-formation pro style offense with one back as your base, do you mirror your ace sets in pistol and shotgun or do you use personnel setups that aren't already present in your ace sets?

Thank you.

To answer your question, I do mirror some of my formations, specifically doubles, trips, and Trey, but there are many complimentary formations as well. For example, I use Normal Y Slot/Flex in the gun but not in Ace. Most of my multiple tight end sets are in Ace only. I have probably every variant of bunch in the game as well.

 

[TXHusker05]

I don't know what my issue is with play calling! I see what defense is doing and I know what I need to do... Yet, I don't do it!

It's like I go into some tunnel vision with my play calling. I have the plays but I'm not using them to attack a defense like I should.

Sent from my LG-D850 using Tapatalk

I get into those funks too. My original Spread-I came completely unraveled because of that. I got so stubborn and was just trying to hammer away with Inside Zone over and over into a 9 man box. In part because I was too worried about making a mistake through the air or falling behind schedule if QBA 5 went haywire on me.

Once I got over that fear and just opened up the offense completely, I was a lot better off.

 

[nofx94]

Couple questions pertaining to realism and style with "pro" playbooks.

Is it unrealistic to run lead, blast, iso, dive, and power o? How are these realistically combined? They all seem so fundamental in their own right as that offenses are based off of them without including the other varieties.

How much effort do y'all put into including multiple permutations of weak and strong into your playbooks? The pro book I'm working on right now is mostly ace heavy with five I sets (including nine plays each in slot and slot flex), and then two each strong (twins and twin TE) and weak (close twins and normal).

At what point do y'all think - individually and of your own experience - it stretches too thin in consistency personnel/philosophy wise?

 

[JSU Zack]

Couple questions pertaining to realism and style with "pro" playbooks.

Is it unrealistic to run lead, blast, iso, dive, and power o? How are these realistically combined? They all seem so fundamental in their own right as that offenses are based off of them without including the other varieties.

How much effort do y'all put into including multiple permutations of weak and strong into your playbooks? The pro book I'm working on right now is mostly ace heavy with five I sets (including nine plays each in slot and slot flex), and then two each strong (twins and twin TE) and weak (close twins and normal).

At what point do y'all think - individually and of your own experience - it stretches too thin in consistency personnel/philosophy wise?

Here's my rub with pro style offenses (even my own): the playbooks are unrealistically large. In the pared down book I plan to use when I coach ball next year, it will be maybe three formations with 9 total plays.

Inside zone
Outside zone
Stick
Mesh
Y Corner
Spot
Sprintout Smash
Waggle
Bubble screen

About 75% of the play calls would be IZ/OZ. Formations would be pistol doubles, trips, and trey.

In reality, you're either a zone team or a gap team. Zone teams use IZ/OZ/Counter Trey. Gap teams use Iso/Power/Toss/Counter Trey. That's about it.

 

[JSU Zack]

Something like this would be ideal. Would allow for the jet series to add one more thing to worry about with IZ and OZ in the same "play".

 

[nofx94]

How does one execute zone from I form outside of stretch and counter? What constitutes inside/outside zone in 20/21/22 personnel sets?

Also, it's fair to say some power teams (Stanford, OSU for instance) run zone read in addition to mostly being power, right?

 

[JSU Zack]

How does one execute zone from I form outside of stretch and counter? What constitutes inside/outside zone in 20/21/22 personnel sets?

Also, it's fair to say some power teams (Stanford, OSU for instance) run zone read in addition to mostly being power, right?

Yes, many power teams have replaced Iso with Blast & Slam, which are IZ plays from 2 back personnel.

 

[nofx94]

Yes, many power teams have replaced Iso with Blast & Slam, which are IZ plays from 2 back personnel.

So for the purposes of the game I'm basically choosing between Iso/dive, power o, crack toss and counter or blast/slam/lead, stretch, and counter. Okay.

I was reading on bleacher report some.of the fundamentals of zone and power. There's not really an in-game version of the trap-and-lead power 2back power plays, is there?

 

[JSU Zack]

So for the purposes of the game I'm basically choosing between Iso/dive, power o, crack toss and counter or blast/slam/lead, stretch, and counter. Okay.

I was reading on bleacher report some.of the fundamentals of zone and power. There's not really an in-game version of the trap-and-lead power 2back power plays, is there?

Not really. 01 trap is the closes thing, but it's not in two back, which is a shame. Every HS runs it.

 

[nofx94]

Well, you've been incredibly helpful. I'm working on this pro playbook right now and at first I was trying to develop it as one-back because that's what my personnel fits right now but my sentiments are in 2-back power. As I won't be using it until at least next season (for realism's sake), I have some time to figure it out.

There's not as much ease or aesthetic pleasure in power running from ace, I feel

 

[TXHusker05]

Not really. 01 trap is the closes thing, but it's not in two back, which is a shame. Every HS runs it.

If you want a two back trap, you can use Shotgun Y Trips Offset and motion the TE into the backfield. If I remember correctly, motioning him "away" from the formation actually moves him into the backfield to be an H/Wing.

It isn't perfect, but its something.