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Traded Picks Thread
- Thread starter doh
- Start date
Gooksta
Well-Known Member
http://www.fangraphs.com/fantasy/always-negotiate-never-haggle/
Always negotiate, never haggle
Yesterday, we discussed how to be a spymaster in your league. It’s a role that’s both fun and rewarding. As usual, we had a good chat session in the comments. I was also emailed a reminder of a previous life – an article titled “Negotiation is not the same as haggling.”
First, some background. Not many years ago, I was jobless and living in Atlanta. So I joined a temp agency. I told them one thing – no sales jobs. Naturally, they immediately sent me to a company with a program to develop temps into software salesmen. Being competitive, I outperformed the other recruits and was the first person to earn a promotion from sales associate (i.e. telemarketer) to account manager (i.e. the actual salesman).
I spent about two years in that job, writing my Daily Grind column in the morning then living, breathing, and pooping ad hoc reporting for the rest of the day. As a salesman who hated salesmen, I sought strategies to defy the traditional approach while still closing business. Clever and baseball obsessed as I am, I called it “pitching backwards.”
It occurs to me that many of my sales strategies and tactics can be applied to fantasy baseball. Today we’ll just focus on one – always negotiate, never haggle.
Haggling is an uninformed grab for more value in a deal. To a gentleman, it is uncouth. To anyone, it can be insulting. A negotiation is a two-way exchange. It requires honesty or at least perceived honesty. ‘Trust’ might be another way to put it. When closing a deal for our software, I would say: “this is how we value our software for your installation. Describe to me (again) your use case and plans.”
Unsurprisingly, our list price was a bargain for a few prospective clients, but most wanted to pay less. The culture of corporate haggling is prevalent (including my boss). After the heady days of the late ’90′s, companies now employ specialized buyers for their technology purchases. Usually, the first thing the buyer would say is something to the effect of “knock 25 percent off the total and you have a deal.” That’s haggling. I would ask a bunch of questions that amounted to “why?” I’d say things like, “I can get discounts approved, but I have to understand why you need them.” After a few conversations, the buyer would accept that I was open to negotiation but wouldn’t cave to demands.
Let’s face it, a fantasy baseball trade is a lot less sophisticated (or important) than a six-figure technology deal. As a salesman, I would often use time as a means to overcome budgetary issues. If you can’t pay all now, then pay more later. In our little world, it’s almost impossible to avoid some form of haggling because there is rarely an opportunity to use the dimension of time. Many leagues expressly or implicitly forbid players to be named later.
Still, there is plenty of opportunity to become known among your peers as a fair negotiator. As some of my rivals can attest, I often frame trade inquiries as “$3 Tanner Roark + X = $16 Jake Arrieta.” Or I’ll open by saying, “I was thinking about X for Y, but obviously we’ll need some other parts. Let’s discuss how we value these two guys to see if a negotiation makes sense.”
Basically, you have to lay some of your cards on the table if you want to hold a proper fantasy baseball negotiation. By laying some earnest groundwork at the beginning of a trade talk, it feels more like a negotiation. Most fantasy owners simply jump into a pattern of offer-counter-counter-walk, leaving one or both owners disgruntled. By properly prepping the discussion, you can have that back and forth exchange without the dirty feel of haggling. What’s more, your prospective trade partner is less likely (in my experience) to solicit other last minute offers.
The theme of these last two days is to be a civilized person. That doesn’t mean you should be a pushover. My leaguemates will be the first to tell you that I stick to my valuations. Sometimes we walk away grumpy, but for us it’s a short-lived feeling. We understand each other, we just weren’t a match today. We’re negotiating.
Always negotiate, never haggle
Yesterday, we discussed how to be a spymaster in your league. It’s a role that’s both fun and rewarding. As usual, we had a good chat session in the comments. I was also emailed a reminder of a previous life – an article titled “Negotiation is not the same as haggling.”
First, some background. Not many years ago, I was jobless and living in Atlanta. So I joined a temp agency. I told them one thing – no sales jobs. Naturally, they immediately sent me to a company with a program to develop temps into software salesmen. Being competitive, I outperformed the other recruits and was the first person to earn a promotion from sales associate (i.e. telemarketer) to account manager (i.e. the actual salesman).
I spent about two years in that job, writing my Daily Grind column in the morning then living, breathing, and pooping ad hoc reporting for the rest of the day. As a salesman who hated salesmen, I sought strategies to defy the traditional approach while still closing business. Clever and baseball obsessed as I am, I called it “pitching backwards.”
It occurs to me that many of my sales strategies and tactics can be applied to fantasy baseball. Today we’ll just focus on one – always negotiate, never haggle.
Haggling is an uninformed grab for more value in a deal. To a gentleman, it is uncouth. To anyone, it can be insulting. A negotiation is a two-way exchange. It requires honesty or at least perceived honesty. ‘Trust’ might be another way to put it. When closing a deal for our software, I would say: “this is how we value our software for your installation. Describe to me (again) your use case and plans.”
Unsurprisingly, our list price was a bargain for a few prospective clients, but most wanted to pay less. The culture of corporate haggling is prevalent (including my boss). After the heady days of the late ’90′s, companies now employ specialized buyers for their technology purchases. Usually, the first thing the buyer would say is something to the effect of “knock 25 percent off the total and you have a deal.” That’s haggling. I would ask a bunch of questions that amounted to “why?” I’d say things like, “I can get discounts approved, but I have to understand why you need them.” After a few conversations, the buyer would accept that I was open to negotiation but wouldn’t cave to demands.
Let’s face it, a fantasy baseball trade is a lot less sophisticated (or important) than a six-figure technology deal. As a salesman, I would often use time as a means to overcome budgetary issues. If you can’t pay all now, then pay more later. In our little world, it’s almost impossible to avoid some form of haggling because there is rarely an opportunity to use the dimension of time. Many leagues expressly or implicitly forbid players to be named later.
Still, there is plenty of opportunity to become known among your peers as a fair negotiator. As some of my rivals can attest, I often frame trade inquiries as “$3 Tanner Roark + X = $16 Jake Arrieta.” Or I’ll open by saying, “I was thinking about X for Y, but obviously we’ll need some other parts. Let’s discuss how we value these two guys to see if a negotiation makes sense.”
Basically, you have to lay some of your cards on the table if you want to hold a proper fantasy baseball negotiation. By laying some earnest groundwork at the beginning of a trade talk, it feels more like a negotiation. Most fantasy owners simply jump into a pattern of offer-counter-counter-walk, leaving one or both owners disgruntled. By properly prepping the discussion, you can have that back and forth exchange without the dirty feel of haggling. What’s more, your prospective trade partner is less likely (in my experience) to solicit other last minute offers.
The theme of these last two days is to be a civilized person. That doesn’t mean you should be a pushover. My leaguemates will be the first to tell you that I stick to my valuations. Sometimes we walk away grumpy, but for us it’s a short-lived feeling. We understand each other, we just weren’t a match today. We’re negotiating.
Wendell Gee
dawg_gone parrothead
I take out my wizard robe and hat.
I didnt get that the first time around
Wendell Gee
dawg_gone parrothead
doh
THANK YOU Dermott McHeshi
Just updated... some interesting stuff:
- Amsterdam is +8 first two round picks the next two drafts.
- I have the right to switch Berlin my first round pick any year from 48-50. It could be the 3rd overall pick this year.
- Buffalo first pick in this draft is BA's 3rd, then their own 5th. They don't own their 1st until 2051.
- Amsterdam is +8 first two round picks the next two drafts.
- I have the right to switch Berlin my first round pick any year from 48-50. It could be the 3rd overall pick this year.
- Buffalo first pick in this draft is BA's 3rd, then their own 5th. They don't own their 1st until 2051.
Lloyd Carr
Well-Known Member
I haven't had a 1st in a long time. I forgot what it feels like to have one.
Gooksta
Well-Known Member
It's over rated outside of the top 10 anyways
FYI @Schauwn @jdlikewhoa FB already dealt their first this year so I have it set up in the Trded Picks thread for next years to go to Lisbon if thats OK.
jdlikewhoa
Well-Known Member
So wait.... There's no draft this year?
Mr. Radpants
Trog Five Standing By
Lloyd Carr
Well-Known Member
I went through the Finalized Trades thread. These changes need to be made to this thread.
2050
Helsingborg 1st to Little Rock
Lisbon 7th to Buffalo
Dublin 1st to San Francisco (via Helsingborg)
Amsterdam 1st to San Francisco (via Helsingborg)
Helsingborg 3rd to San Francisco
2051
Buffalo 2nd to Lisbon (via Seoul)
2052
Buffalo 2nd to North Dakota
I could have missed others, but I know these ones need to be updated.
2050
Helsingborg 1st to Little Rock
Lisbon 7th to Buffalo
Dublin 1st to San Francisco (via Helsingborg)
Amsterdam 1st to San Francisco (via Helsingborg)
Helsingborg 3rd to San Francisco
2051
Buffalo 2nd to Lisbon (via Seoul)
2052
Buffalo 2nd to North Dakota
I could have missed others, but I know these ones need to be updated.
Yankee151
Hot Girl Summer
Both me and Wolf have a Seoul 3rd. If it's okay I'll take the 2051 one? @Wolfman21 @Karl Hungus