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1978-2020 KOBE

pavel

fried foods world champs
Utopia Moderator
#1
Boys, I was out in the spa just reflecting on things from today, and figured this formative event in most of our lives deserved it's own thread. I'm sure the NBA thread would do a decent job of containing the posts that are sure to come, but at the same time, this loss needs space. Space for discussion, theories, memories, shitposts, memes, and all the other ways some of us will handle the events of this morning. The NBA thread will move on with the requisite RUSS/TRAE/BOOK etc posts, and it should, so go there for NBA talk, and stay here if you wanna talk Kobe for the rest of time, or until Travis jihads this site. Anyway, here goes...

I'm sitting here trying to come up with a public loss that affected me like this, and I just can't. I'll always remember the Magic announcement, which felt like a death, but obviously wasn't. I think the closest thing I can come up with is that I imagine some people felt the same way when Princess DI was killed. A precocious global icon not without personal blemishes taken after the defining chapter of her life, but still far too soon. I remember taking B-rips at Cal when I heard, and it didn't really affect me. But clearly the Brits were devastated. I had spent the summer in England and remember being only slightly sad. Shocked at the suddenness, mostly. Michael Jackson or Elvis? Nah, too troubled. I assume the Kennedy Assassination was similar.

I remember watching Kobe airball those playoff 3's against the Jazz in my freshman dorms, but even then you sort of knew that wasn't going to last- he would only get better. The Lakers were such absolute shit for a few years there, it was nice to see them starting to return to the BIRTHRIGHT legacy I and everyone that followed them expected.

I'll remember the 15-1 playoff record, the helicopter flights back and forth to Eagle, CO, the phase where he really did shoot too much, and all the times I felt I knew him. His rapport with Chick, Stu, Sager, Marv, everyone. Just a flawed human, but one I kinda had to pull for on account of his jersey. Sports is weird, and no one is perfect, but watching him evolve into what he was becoming in LA and beyond was just a delight. He really seemed to be as good of a father as he was on the court, and that was really what hurts the most.

Which brings me to today. For about 3 hours this evening I was just a mess. I'm not sure why, but something about the way in which things ended just wrecks me. Did he know? Did he try to comfort his daughter? What, if anything, can prepare you, or any of us, for that moment when we are confronted with the futility of it all- when your whole plan for yourself and your child is erased? That's what has been the most difficult thing for me. Life is precious, and it can be taken in an instant. The timing with Lebron and some of the final tweets just add to the bizarre and fleeting nature of our lives. That's what is most jarring to me, most permanent.

At the same time, I'm trying to make sense of what I can, as a way to cope- stuff like the data seems to show the helicopter crashed on a downslope, which seems odd. Will be interesting to see what the investigation reveals, my hunch is that it clipped a pole or a tower or a wire and couldn't recover.

Anyway, this thread is for all things Kobe. Laker fans are the closest thing I have to a sports "fraternity", and I know a bunch of the true homies on here (@bruin @BasinBictory @Orlando @TrojanMan (apologies if I left anyone out) are going through similar stuff, so post away...
 
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bruin

Well-Known Member
#2

I like to harp on Plas cause I partially blame him for the UCLA downfall (calling UCLA will win the natty in 2001 after demolishing Cal to a 6-0 start)

but this hits so close to home. We cry with you Bill.
 

bruin

Well-Known Member
#3
Kobe is my Sister’s age.
Her senior year (1996) -same year Jerry West trades for him.
I still remember her commenting on how cute he was and that he took BRANDY to the prom and all that.
Young bruin thought to myself “Vlade, really?”

Said in the madden infinity thread yesterday was my birthday. Been going through some shit...
was too young for Magic, still remember being at Rudy’s Pub & Grill in Newps when Michael Jackson died but that’s not even in the same ...well you know
just seeing the outpour..OCC coach and his wife and kid. The wife that coached at the Mamba academy of the musician from HB. The kids..man. I thank god every day I don’t have any (that I know of) Shit..I can’t even take care of myself..
b

Sorry for the rambling. Emotions are at a current all time high. Just feel for the families man. It’s not right.
 
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Orlando

Well-Known Member
Utopia Moderator
#5
Yeah. The other families and kids involved hits hard. It’s tragic. Its so surreal because it’s just a complete shock. It’s not a troubled Cobain or Tony Gwynn and his battle with cancer. You still just kind of can’t believe it.
 

bruin

Well-Known Member
#7
Man. Best lay of my life was the night of besting the Celtics in game 7 in 2010. Ron Artest (WHEATIES BOX) 3 clincher. Walked like 20 minutes to In-N-Out in Laguna Hills with a big smile on my face.

Time for one more pour...RIP Bean
 

Wolfman21

Well-Known Member
#10
The part thats hit me the hardest has been the kids lost, and the kids now left without a father, a mother, a sister, or all of the above. Ive had two separate moments of just straight up crying thinking about that. Thinking about the people who had to inform those people that their lives have just been....ripped apart. I cant fathom the feelings.

I also am continuously putting myself and my daughter in their shoes and how terrifying it is and unbelievably sad it makes me.

Kobe will be missed, gone way too soon and i totally get the outpouring of grief from around the world at his loss. Past is in the past, he seemed like a wonderful father now and i absolutely HATE that he will have 3 daughters that wont have him there to walk them down the aisle or to hold them when they need it...and the same with the other families. My heart has broken numerous times just thinking about it. I dunno...shit sucks man. You just wanna rewind 48 hours and change things, but you cant. Life goes on and i just pray that the families affected by this have support systems like no other.
 

BasinBictory

CHICKEN NUT BREAD
#11
You know, I've always been one who found it odd, or strange, or even vain when there was this huge public outpouring of grief for a public figure when almost all of the grieving people had never met this person IRL, never knew what they were like outside of their public persona, and only knew them based on their public exploits as an athlete, politician, singer, entertainer, comedian, etc.

I guess I always equated it as a larger version of the numerous funerals I attended as a kid and as a young adult where people who I knew that barely knew the deceased were wailing in the aisles, making spectacles of themselves, and basically "showing off" how much they were going to miss the deceased (even though they hadn't seen them in years and barely spoke to them) in almost this bizarre "grief Olympics."

But hearing about Kobe's death actually hit me unbelievably hard, and this as someone who had thought of Kobe as an absolutely fantastic player, an absolutely single-minded competitor, but also kind of a dick - the sort of person who pursues and demands excellence from himself, but who has no tolerance for those who didn't share his single-minded devotion to basketball excellence. Witness how he basically ran off Shaq, Dwight Howard, and sort of Lamar Odom. Calling Jeremy Lin "soft as Charmin." (Which was actually sort of funny --- and accurate).

I was at a birthday party for my niece and nephew yesterday morning when my brother in law showed me the TMZ headline on his phone. He's a HUUUGE Lakers fan, much more than I am, and I think neither of us believed it at first. I saw "TMZ" and immediately thought "Ah, tabloid rag FAKE NEWS!"

So I went to, of all sites, Wikipedia, where, sure enough, under the entry for Kobe Bryant, it had his birthdate, August 23, 1978, and then said Death: January 26, 2020, Calabasas, CA.

For some reason, seeing it there (as opposed to TMZ, or even KTLA.com) made me realize it was probably true.

Initial reports were that 5 people were on board, none of whom were Kobe's family members. So I thought - "Oh, how sad for Kobe's family, but ar least his girls and his wife are all okay." I thought maybe the other passengers were business associates or the like, and while tragic, of course, it was a "manageable" tragedy, if such a thing exists.

Then as the reports kept coming in about who was also on board the chopper - Kobe's 13-year old daughter, two of her teammates, their parents, and an assistant coach of the basketball academy, it really REALLY hit about just how awful a tragedy this was. Kids dying in almost any context is really difficult for me to handle, as I am a father of two school-age kids myself (well, one is 17, ready to join the ranks of aimless youth soon), but hearing about almost entire families wiped out - one girl with both her parents, another with her mom, and of course Gianna and her dad, made me realize how profound a loss such a thing must be for those left behind.

Hearing also Doc Rivers give his tearful interview, and seeing the utter devastation on Jerry West's face had me dealing with a freak indoor dust storm. In the midst of what has so far been one of the most exciting Laker seasons in recent memory, now it doesn't seem to matter hardly at all.
 

kella

Smug know-it-all
Staff member
Administrator
Operations
#12
What, if anything, can prepare you, or any of us, for that moment when we are confronted with the futility of it all- when your whole plan for yourself and your child is erased? That's what has been the most difficult thing for me. Life is precious, and it can be taken in an instant.
I spend what I'm sure is an unhealthy amount of time thinking about this. Dying instantly and surprisingly - like a stray bullet to the dome, or randomly in your sleep, is one thing. But taking quick stock of your chances (like this, a helicopter hurtling toward a hill) when you probably have a good 10, 15 seconds or more, and the sheer panic and nausea that must overwhelm you. Cancer usually gives you some time. Even 3 months is an eternity compared to something like this.

The other interesting thing is that on this side of the country, it is considered kind of bad taste to be a huge Kobe-stan. Especially among non-sports fans he was known almost exclusively for the Shaq drama and sexual assault.

It's a very complicated legacy, to say the least.
 
#13
I posted this in the Corona Virus thread but figured I'll drop it here too:

I don't think it's revisionist history.

The hero worship of Kobe is a bit much, he was a best an extremely flawed person and at worst a rapist. But I also don't think it's fair to define him solely by the rape.

What you guys don't seem to understand is the affect he had on the basketball community during his time. He was a person that created personal relationships with many, many players, media members, and even fans. Just look at players responses, almost every one has a personal anecdote about Kobe helping their game, how they train, or being there for them personally in a time of need. This isn't common or expected but he did it out of love of the game.

He also was a massive supporter of women's basketball, supporting the WNBA in many ways, and mentoring young women's players like Sabrina Ionescu. Again, no one would have questioned if he didn't do this.

I think people's emotion is because he was the shining example of a pure love for the game of basketball, involved in every facet, the face of competition. There isn't a corner that he hasn't touched and the basketball community is a lot more close-knit than other sports imo.

So, I feel the outpouring of emotion is in some ways almost more about the hole he left in the community as a mentor, leader, and idol than just Kobe as person. Kobe as a person wasn't a very good person in all likelihood but he also affected many many many people in a positive way.

I dont know.
 

bruin228

Well-Known Member
NCAA Moderator
#14
Lol I was just about to quote that as a jumping off point for my thoughts.

I'll preface this by stating I'm not a Lakers fan and wouldn't really ever consider myself a Kobe fan; I hated him during his playing career and it was really only after he retired and I'd watch stuff on YouTube both old and new that I started to come around a little more, so if you don't want to read this drivel, I understand. I don't know how lucid this is gonna be, but I've been turning this over in my head this morning, especially after reading this (which I think is a fairly even-handed take on the complications of Kobe): https://theoutline.com/post/8602/kobe-bryant-dead-social-media-rape-sexual-assault?zd=1&zi=amqfayzu

It’s this last one that I understand a little more: Kobe did hundreds of conventionally great things by a public standard, insofar as athletes are venerated and celebrated by society, and one conventionally horrible thing by a private standard. In recent years he had, as public figures with deep bank accounts are able to do, completely rehabilitated his image as that of a family man, philanthropist, WNBA booster and even an Oscar winner (in the same year that the Academy claimed to be seriously grappling with Hollywood’s sexual misconduct crisis). Since none of us really knew him anyways, and he seemed like such a great dad and an alright husband (his wife Vanessa stood by him), it was much easier to just sort of… move on, and behave as though it never happened, or as if we had all silently and uniformly agreed that it was bad, yes, but isn’t life complicated, and… uhh he’s done a lot of good so... (trails off into the distance). After all, what’s one maybe-rape measured against 81 points in a game and five championships? What’s the private pain of one anonymous person against the public joy of millions?
There are a lot of famous people that I admire/whatever throughout my life that have done things that range from objectionable to pretty heinous (David Foster Wallace, Liam Gallagher, Brett Favre for a sports figure comparison, so on) - maybe not anything as bad as rape - but things you, theoretically, would not stand for but you are willing to ignore/accept because of the greater body of work if you will. There are people directly in my life like this; there was this professor I had in grad school that slept with students. That was all consensual, but there's of course the tricky power dynamic at play; this may even be an extremely poor taste comparison to what happened with Kobe, but it's what I've got at a personal level. But he was also the sweetest guy I ever interacted with in that program that was, frankly, terrible and cold and frustrating. He helped me out in a million different ways, he was a great professor that legitimately cared about people, that cared about the state of things and so on. So there are people you're willing to make concessions for in some ways in your personal life and I think that extends to people you don't even know.

This isn't even a "separating artist from the art" type of deal, I think it's trying to look at the whole complexity of the person. Maybe it's just willful ignorance, there are alarm bells that are going off in my head that I'm attempting to make excuses. But I think that sort of viewpoint is important. There's a lot of moral dogmatism at work these days that I find extremely frustrating and taxing. This isn't to say that we should give a pass to rapists or abusers or racists or whatever it may be. However, there is a lot of stuff at work that people absolutely do not want to grapple with, because it's easier to take a side in a sense (Kobe was a rapist/who cares, Kobe won my team titles). There are a lot of attempts to boil down people, especially people we don't even know, to one or a handful of events in their life. This isn't excusing behavior or saying that we can't criticize people we've never met. Kobe was a rapist, probably an asshole teammate at times, and probably an asshole at times; Kobe was also a great basketball player that inspired a LOT of kids to work hard and follow their dreams and seemingly a great dad. We have to give people an opportunity to grow and, from my perspective of not knowing him at all, it seems like he did that in some ways. That doesn't erase what he did or that woman's pain and trauma, and Kobe should've faced the consequences of that more than he did. But I also feel like there's too much...finality? in the way we view things now. I think @bruin @bruin228's post (his most recent one) sat with me too, because that moment of joy is something legitimate, even if it something as "minor" as sports. That "private pain of one anonymous person against the public joy of millions" is something heavy to turn over in your head philosophically and ethically, I think.
 

kella

Smug know-it-all
Staff member
Administrator
Operations
#15
I find it hard to separate all that from the knowledge that there ARE people who don't care that he probably forced some, as you say, anonymous woman into having sex with him because he won their favorite team titles. Those people do exist, in large numbers, and they should feel bad.

It's these guys literally

 

evil1

Well-Known Member
#16
Also posted in the Corona virus thread, so I might was well post it here too:

If people want to include the rape charge when talking about Kobe's life, they are certainly free to do so, but I think it deserves to be mentioned that there is a good chance that Kobe was, in fact, innocent.

Without going into too much detail, there were inconsistencies in the accuser's story (some minor and some a little more questionable) and the rape kit showed DNA from at least two men, none of whom were Kobe Bryant. Maybe there is still enough to the accusation to muddle how we remember Kobe, but I don't like the presumption of guilt that is being suggested by some of the commenters throughout the internet.
 

Yankee151

TWINK Stadium
#21
First, I'm proud to see my BOOK posts are now prevalent enough to make it amongst the RUSS and TRAE posts referenced in the OP, despite barely watching any basketball.

I'll do this backwards. I think after hearing the news about the passengers, including his daughter and 3/5ths of another family (Orange Baseball), it immediately becomes extra tragic. I think the implications are obvious when children and families are nearly wiped out like that. Losing one loved one is hard, losing them before their time is even harder, but an entire family? Those survivors are going to be going through some stuff for a very long time and some wounds never fully heal.

As for Kobe as a sportsman, I wasn't as torn up about that aspect initially, partially because basketball wasn't a big part of my life growing up. I've always been a way-too-small hispanic kid more interested in baseball or football growing up (now KUNMANO soccer and HALEP tennis as well), and so while sad, I went about my day mostly as usual. I felt mostly the same around the Roy Halladay crash; An ultra talented, legendary player gone too soon, but not one I necessarily was a direct fan of. Perhaps it's an effect of experiencing a lot of death at a young age, but deaths only get to me when (See above paragraph) I empathize with the survivors.

Then I started thinking more about it wrt who the equivalent athlete could be. I mentioned Roberto Clemente in the earlier thread, a mega-star who meant more to his community outside the game than he did inside it, but that would've been my father's time and not mine. Jose Fernandez would be a good example, a huge boon to the cuban community and a TAMPA kid at that, with a grey-area death that maybe was caused by a boat DUI.

Mostly, the death just serves as a reminder that time isn't guaranteed. It can all turn for the worst in the blink of an eye, so I made sure to extra cherish my day yesterday.
 

Wuf

Desensitized and Willing
#22
What's hitting me the hardest has nothing to do with Kobe as a person, although I never really thought he raped that girl in Eagle and later-in-life Kobe seemed like a much more likable figure.

I love basketball. I grew up in a basketball-crazy state and although nobody gave a shit about the NBA, I knew tons of kids with Kobe jerseys. I never really liked the Lakers, which has only been reinforced becoming a Denver Nuggets fan these past few years, and I remember all the critiques on Kobe as a player, and I would chime in on them. But, much like a Tom Brady, the sheer longevity of Kobe, as a basketball fan, is truly astounding and I think the loyalty to a team for 20 years is something that is crazy for modern times. And just like Brady, you see him win so much over the years you can't help but respect the game, if not necessarily as people.

Kobe played in the NBA from when I was ages 9-29. He was hitting fade away jumpers when I was in Umbros, when I grew I my first pube, when I was at senior prom and college keggers and all the extreme highs and horrible lows all across my life. Basketball, and sports in general, is often times the only way I can really relate to people in a meaningful way and that is very difficult for me at times, and Kobe represented a constant in that realm. He's been a constant among one of the only things in life that brings me pure joy. His dominance ran concurrent with all these formative years for myself and I feel weirdly sentimental about his death now because it makes my own mortality feel more real. His presence loomed larger than life, he's a god to all the young players today, and literally all of them have a story about him helping them be the best player they can be. So with all that in mind, it's hard even as a fan of a rival team to come to grips with this one.

And then on top of that, his daughter, her teammates and their parents are killed along with it. Kobe just giving them a ride to the game, nice rich dad type stuff. And like others have said, I can't help but think about what is going through all of their minds as that helicopter clips the mountain, catches on fire, and starts plummeting. Like what the fuck do you do? No NBA Finals Game 7 is gonna prepare you for that moment. That's when I start tearing up. It's not a healthy thing to think about, it's an absolutely horrible way to die, and I'm not sure I'd wish it on anyone. I felt like Kobe was gonna be the great basketball mentor that MJ never wanted to be after he stopped playing, I think he was really embracing that role.

My only question in regards to the actual wreck is why they were given the go-ahead to fly in those conditions when even LAPD choppers were grounded because of the visibility issues, was somebody insistent? Can you dance around protocol easier when you're flying privately? I'm sure one of you mooks has an answer for me.

A touchstone of my generation has been lost under horrifying circumstances, and it makes me very sad.
 

Travis7401

Douglass Tagg
Community Liaison
#23
My most KOBE memory revolves around sports vidya and Y2K. We went to ma'grandparents house in BFE Wyoming for a big family reunion that Christmas and stayed through new years. My cousin had an N64 with NBA COURTSIDE 2 FEATURING KOBE BRYANT. The windchill was like -10 the whole time we were there, so we spent a lot of time on the sticks. DAYS ON END. I mean we ran through almost an entire NBA season over that week and our biggest Y2K concern was that any digital interruption might screw up our playoff run, lol.

I remember feeling bad for him due to the constant comparisons to Jordan in a GOAT race. Why can't someone just be a perfectly amazing basketball player and a once in a generation talent without needing to decide whether they were the GOAT?

I don't know the true origin of his Black Mamba nickname, but I like to believe that he's the only corny dude to ever successfully coin his own nickname and be persistent enough with it to make it stick. I want to believe, and I won't let anyone tell me otherwise.
 

pavel

fried foods world champs
Utopia Moderator
#25
$1000 gets you in the building tomorrow night. All stubhub proceeds go to the Kobe and Vanessa foundation. Tempting
 

Yankee151

TWINK Stadium
#27
btw I like how even in CLOWNZANO's self centered article, he calls hisself out on only focusing on stuff that happens hours before the game and turns it into entire articles. In this case it's warranted, but it's his exact formula for anything like Larry Scott and Phil Knight dipping their tortilla chips in queso instead of salsa taking up an entire 4 paragraphs.

CORVALLIS -- You may be here to read about Sunday afternoon’s college basketball game. It featured two of the best teams in the country. But I never really got beyond the scene at center court one hour before tip.
 

Orlando

Well-Known Member
Utopia Moderator
#34
I read that this was Kobe's personal helicopter. Was the pilot really in a position to tell the boss "sorry, not flying today"?
I’m not sure if it was, but it doesn’t do much to speculate that convo. I was just trying to answer why they could take off if LAPD was grounded.
 
#35
What's hitting me the hardest has nothing to do with Kobe as a person, although I never really thought he raped that girl in Eagle and later-in-life Kobe seemed like a much more likable figure.

I love basketball. I grew up in a basketball-crazy state and although nobody gave a shit about the NBA, I knew tons of kids with Kobe jerseys. I never really liked the Lakers, which has only been reinforced becoming a Denver Nuggets fan these past few years, and I remember all the critiques on Kobe as a player, and I would chime in on them. But, much like a Tom Brady, the sheer longevity of Kobe, as a basketball fan, is truly astounding and I think the loyalty to a team for 20 years is something that is crazy for modern times. And just like Brady, you see him win so much over the years you can't help but respect the game, if not necessarily as people.

Kobe played in the NBA from when I was ages 9-29. He was hitting fade away jumpers when I was in Umbros, when I grew I my first pube, when I was at senior prom and college keggers and all the extreme highs and horrible lows all across my life. Basketball, and sports in general, is often times the only way I can really relate to people in a meaningful way and that is very difficult for me at times, and Kobe represented a constant in that realm. He's been a constant among one of the only things in life that brings me pure joy. His dominance ran concurrent with all these formative years for myself and I feel weirdly sentimental about his death now because it makes my own mortality feel more real. His presence loomed larger than life, he's a god to all the young players today, and literally all of them have a story about him helping them be the best player they can be. So with all that in mind, it's hard even as a fan of a rival team to come to grips with this one.

And then on top of that, his daughter, her teammates and their parents are killed along with it. Kobe just giving them a ride to the game, nice rich dad type stuff. And like others have said, I can't help but think about what is going through all of their minds as that helicopter clips the mountain, catches on fire, and starts plummeting. Like what the fuck do you do? No NBA Finals Game 7 is gonna prepare you for that moment. That's when I start tearing up. It's not a healthy thing to think about, it's an absolutely horrible way to die, and I'm not sure I'd wish it on anyone. I felt like Kobe was gonna be the great basketball mentor that MJ never wanted to be after he stopped playing, I think he was really embracing that role.

My only question in regards to the actual wreck is why they were given the go-ahead to fly in those conditions when even LAPD choppers were grounded because of the visibility issues, was somebody insistent? Can you dance around protocol easier when you're flying privately? I'm sure one of you mooks has an answer for me.

A touchstone of my generation has been lost under horrifying circumstances, and it makes me very sad.
I relate to this post. As stupid as it sounds, I don't know where I'd be without basketball. I was a shy kid growing up. I would say 90%+ of my friends from elementary through high school were because we were basketball teammates of mine at some point. The only 2 people I keep in contact with from HS were my teammates for 6 years. My being (kinda) good at basketball gave me self-confidence that I didn't naturally have. Without sports I likely would've been a severely depressed loner, and my entire life would be different. Basketball was THE thing I cared about from like 6-16.

For my generation, Kobe was the epitome of hard work, basketball IQ, toughness, and passion. Every basketball coach pointed to Kobe and said "See, you don't become a superstar by accident. This is what it takes." Any serious basketball player wanted the drive and motivation of Kobe.

Kobe vs Lebron vs Jordan was a common discussion at the lunch table. He was really just a constant in any basketball discussion. Shooting warmup shots at the beginning of practice it was a given someone bricks a 180 turnaround fadeaway and yells "Kobe!"

I'm rambling now, but the fact that he's so entwined with basketball culture makes this that much more shocking.

And with his daughter, the other kids, the other parents....it's a tragedy no matter if you think Kobe is a good person or not.
 

OU11

Pleighboi
Utopia Moderator
#40
The thing that really bothers me about this whole thing is the Corch and his wife and daughter. I read that they left behind 2 children (I think, could be misremembering) who weren't on the helicopter and that is just ridiculously sad. Those kids got word from TMZ that a chopper they probably knew their parents and sister were on crashed and everyone died. Thinking about their day yesterday got to me. I deal with a certain aspect of things like this for my jerb and I've seen similar situations play out and it just gave me a real heavy feeling since I found out.

It goes back to what multiple people said, it's the abrupt end to lives filled with plans and ambitions. The finality is on display more here than I think some other cases of celebrity deaths, where they were going and what they were doing adds to the weight. Everyone can relate in one way or another to a number of passengers which is another reason I think this has hit so hard. Not many people could relate to Michael Jackson or Elvis.
 

Brick

Well-Known Member
#41
btw I like how even in CLOWNZANO's self centered article, he calls hisself out on only focusing on stuff that happens hours before the game and turns it into entire articles. In this case it's warranted, but it's his exact formula for anything like Larry Scott and Phil Knight dipping their tortilla chips in queso instead of salsa taking up an entire 4 paragraphs.
*column
 

goblue96

Disney and Curling Expert
#44
The thing that really bothers me about this whole thing is the Corch and his wife and daughter. I read that they left behind 2 children (I think, could be misremembering) who weren't on the helicopter and that is just ridiculously sad. Those kids got word from TMZ that a chopper they probably knew their parents and sister were on crashed and everyone died. Thinking about their day yesterday got to me. I deal with a certain aspect of things like this for my jerb and I've seen similar situations play out and it just gave me a real heavy feeling since I found out.

It goes back to what multiple people said, it's the abrupt end to lives filled with plans and ambitions. The finality is on display more here than I think some other cases of celebrity deaths, where they were going and what they were doing adds to the weight. Everyone can relate in one way or another to a number of passengers which is another reason I think this has hit so hard. Not many people could relate to Michael Jackson or Elvis.
Thin Elvis who was banging Ann Margaret or fat bloated poor choices Elvis? A lot of people can relate to making poor choices while being fat and bloated.
 

TrojanMan

Pink Panther
Mod Alumni
#45
Stream of consciousness thoughts......

*This is the first celebrity death that hit me hard, in......I can't remember the last one, honestly. He wasn't an actor/rockstar/playboy where drugs and hard partying are assumed, and you hear "So-and-so died," and your first thought is, "well, that's not terribly surprising." It was more like....wait, what?!?! Kobe?!?! Healthy, athletic, young, family man, all around good dude (now), Kobe???

*I started crying 3 or 4 separate times yesterday. But it wasn't because Kobe is gone. It was because I couldn't stop thinking about what pavel mentioned.....those last 10-15 seconds where Kobe undoubtedly knew this was the end for him and his daughter. And where those other parents on board knew the same thing. What do you do? How do you handle that? Your most primal instinct as a parent is to protect your kids. But to know that not only can you not save them, but you can't comfort them, or make sure they're not terrified during their last breaths on earth. Awful. Fucking, awful. I can't imagine a worse way to go. And then on top of that, you've got spouses....and worse, kids.....left behind who have to try to process all that.

*Kobe is probably my favorite athlete....ever. It helps, obviously, that he spent his entire career with my local team. And not just any local team; the one with more success than the rest of them, combined. He came into the league wearing my favorite number (yes, 8 was my favorite number before Kobe was an NBA player) That made me like him even more, right out of the gates. He was athletic as fuck, and so fun to watch. Let's be honest, he was also kind of an asshole. Super standoffish in his early days; not exactly a warm and fuzzy personality. But that drive, that work ethic, that will to win.....it was super human. Kobe, later in life, seemed like a much 'better person.' Far less of a dick, and an involved family man. No, I won't go into details about Colorado -- I have no idea what did, or didn't, happen. It's not a good look, either way. But whatever he did or didn't do there, he seems to have evolved into a loving, caring husband and father. I never met the guy. I am friends with, and in some cases related to, several people who had met him, or knew him at more than a "I met him one time" level, and they all say he was a legitimately great human. It's a big loss.

*But again, the kids....both those who passed, and those who lost parents and siblings....are what really make this awful. Kobe was a young guy, but he accomplished more in half his life than most people would accomplish if they had 5 lifetimes. The kids never got a chance. They never got a chance. And they couldn't even go out with peace of mind. That's what tears me up.
 

pavel

fried foods world champs
Utopia Moderator
#47
ESPN is about to show Kobe’s final game, but first we have to sit thru this absolute abortion of FT misses and timeouts in UNC-NCST? The last 30 seconds have taken 20 minutes amd they keep fouling.

This is embarrassing @Wuf @Wolfman21
 

Wolfman21

Well-Known Member
#49
ESPN is about to show Kobe’s final game, but first we have to sit thru this absolute abortion of FT misses and timeouts in UNC-NCST? The last 30 seconds have taken 20 minutes amd they keep fouling.

This is embarrassing @Wuf @Wolfman21
I dont care about nc state basketball.

I don’t know that they knew the end was near. Sounds like maybe the pilot just flew straight into the hill in the fog.
Ive read they flew straight into the hill and ive read that there was a very quick descent and then crash on a downslope. The eyewitness guy said he heard sputtering or something as well. So who knows. Will be interesting to find out what actually happened. I hope for everyone they just flew into the mountain and were never the wiser