Whenever I ran Spot from Trio 4WR Str, I just hot routed the back to a flat/swing and motioned to the flat WR to the other side to get a 2x2 alignment. You can do a bunch of other stuff off that motion look.
All of @bruin228's Mesh stuff has me thinking about creating a mesh screen via Slip Screen. Takes the same motion as my HB Crack Screen I mentioned before, but now turns it into a WR Mid Screen, just in formations that don't otherwise have a mid screen available (all offset formations with a TE, wing or on line).
Would pair it with manual motion with either the decoy WR or the intended WR and throw. It is a slip screen but the pass is completed right at or behind the line of scrimmage so it is still legal within our rules. If I got pressure or press man I'd throw the HB wheel out of the backfield as an alert.
Works alright if you get the timing right and the blocks to match up. Occasionally the underneath WR will get lost in traffic and it'll just go incomplete. I like it a little bit better than using the in/out to the HB to adjust slip screen just because there is a little less congestion and there is also some built in misdirection since most users won't be thinking "mid screen" in these formations. It works in just about every offset wing formation and even the offset with a TE on the line formations.
Can't imagine anyone would call it out for cheese or against the rules since the throw is right at the LOS. And that's without even aiming it, if I had to I could aim low and have him come back behind the LOS like I do on the in/out slip screen.
The best version of the in/out slip screen I have found so far is actually in various Split Offset formations, using either Mtn Cross Screen or the base Slip Screen.
In Split Offset, using Slip Screen:
All I'm doing is keying the flat defender, which in this case becomes the MLB. He widens, I throw the "out" middle screen to the second back. Had he stayed home or I got a CB blitz or something where the flat defender is MIA, I just throw the wheel out there looking to cut back behind the blocks.
Same thing with the Mtn Cross Screen from Split Y Offset:
In this case, I'm keying the flat defender to the orbit motion side. If he stays home, I go back side to the "out" middle screen. If there is a blitz, no flat defender or a user is in man to man and forgets to cover the HB manually, I'll just lob the orbit swing screen out there. Hopefully getting it to him before he stops so he catches it on the move.
I've come up with a few other variations of screens but these have been my three favorite so far, in addition to my standard bubble, now and triple screens.
What I really want is some TE screens. I've played around with a few different options but haven't liked them. The "best" one so far is using PA WR Screen in either Normal Offset or Y Trips Offset and hot routing the TE to a flat. It isn't perfect, but it usually gets a few yards. I like the one in Normal Offset the most because you still get a SE/Now screen to the twin WR side and then you get a TE flat screen to the other which is solid vs press. The only other idea is just to put a TE at one of the HB or WR spots to run any of the screens above. It isn't a legit TE screen but it at least gets my TE the ball. Not sure how else to make it work.
On the first and second clip your guy caught the pass beyond the LOS. I think your pushing some AI limits and I'm opposed.
On neither clip did they catch the ball beyond the line of scrimmage.
Not even remotely close actually.
On neither clip did they catch the ball beyond the line of scrimmage.
Not even remotely close actually.
I'd say you're teetering on the edge of exploit land. I know you're trying to make real concepts, but if you hot route a ton, it can break the games logic.
I can understand double screens with the default routes or swing routes, but drags? Idk, man. That's pushing it to me.
You don't have to be THAT varied in your screen game. How many screens are you throwing per game? Even the pirate only throws about a half dozen.
Huh? LOS is the 30. 1st clip he catches it on the 28.5, 2nd clip is on the 29. So uh yeah they did.
I'd say you're teetering on the edge of exploit land. I know you're trying to make real concepts, but if you hot route a ton, it can break the games logic.
I can understand double screens with the default routes or swing routes, but drags? Idk, man. That's pushing it to me.
You don't have to be THAT varied in your screen game. How many screens are you throwing per game? Even the pirate only throws about a half dozen.
By the way, @JSU Zack, to answer your questions:
I run 3-5 screens with OL releasing down field a game. Max. If we include bubble/now screens, it is between 5-10 but since we aren't talking about bubble/now, we'll ignore that. Using tonight's game as an example, I ran 4 screens involving OL releasing down the field. 1 2x2 Triple Screen that was a dropped INT, 1 Full House Triple Screen that was a 4 yard loss, 1 screen like Video 3 which was a dropped INT and 1 screen like Video 2 which went for a 29 yard TD. On that TD, the user was in 335 Stack Press Man, blitzing all 3 LB and manually blitzed the man (FS) assigned to the back who caught the pass. 4 screens of 30 pass attempts and 61 total plays, that's around 6% of my total snaps if I'm doing the mental math right. That's nothing. I threw 4 bubble screens as well, which is automatic vs uncovered slot for me and almost all of my formations have a PA Bubble audible.
To be honest, I DO have to be THAT varied with my screen game. Bubble, now and mid screens are rendered worthless by press man coverage and literally all I see any more is press man coverage. You know that as well as I do @JSU Zack because you and I are defended exactly the same. If I'm going to face press man across the board and all these exotic, unrealistic, absurd fronts, I'm going to run dual read slow screens.
I am tired of punching myself in the dick trying to run right into a exotic front, loaded box, 335 defenses with safeties manually walked down to the linebacker level or manually controlled DL. I'm done doing that. If someone, and it seems like most people these days, want to sit in a 335 and shift their front all to hell and walk players down to unrealistic positions (something that IS illegal)... I'm going to run my completely legal and completely realistic screen game to take advantage of it. These screens are specifically aimed to attack the 335 by reading off of the overhang safety. I'm tired of watching people exploit the game and call it defense and since no one seems to give a shit about that, my give a fuck level about what people think of my screen game is at zero.
Not with Qba 5Quite thorough.
Would it just be better to run regular passes at attack the fronts?
Not with Qba 5
Run run screen runI'm not even online, but the results of QBA5 from some Heisman sliders I got from here or OS were the whole reason I went into the pass clinic thread. "I must be doing something wrong. How do people play each other with this shit going on?"
I'm not even online, but the results of QBA5 from some Heisman sliders I got from here or OS were the whole reason I went into the pass clinic thread. "I must be doing something wrong. How do people play each other with this shit going on?"
LOL you are one crazy SOB sometimes (and I say that with some degree of admiration). The ball is on the 30. Practice mode puts the ball on the 30. The OL splits, the WR are all lined up as if the ball is on the 30. In the first 2 clips the receiver catches the ball a good yard past the LOS.
Please someone else weigh in here. I'm getting older, and my eyesight isn't what it used to be, but if that's not the 30 for the LOS, and if that is not the receiver catching the ball at the 29 then I guess I don't understand the LOS.
Here is a picture I just took of practice mode.
View attachment 2144
As I'm not in anyone's dynasty, I'm not complaining about anyone's dynasty's rules. I'm just trying to get better for it for my own enjoyment. So tips are always welcome, but I'm not sure exactly what this has to do with what I exactly was saying.It prevents every pass from being 100% on the money. It allows for a few WTF Matt Cassel like throws. It forces people to set their feet and not rocket everything. No it's not perfect, but it beats the alternative IMO.
Here are the passing leaders in the ACC user OD. Wake Forest @bluejay13 is completing 78%, @Akecheta is at 72% and I'm at 70%.
View attachment 2146
As I'm not in anyone's dynasty, I'm not complaining about anyone's dynasty's rules. I'm just trying to get better for it for my own enjoyment. So tips are always welcome, but I'm not sure exactly what this has to do with what I exactly was saying.
High and Outside seems to be the only way guided passes arent fucked. Or lobbing when you should bullet and bullet when you should lobI've had seasons with high completion percentage. I'm just trying to figure out how to limit picks. Evidently guided passing is a death warrant
Quite thorough.
Would it just be better to run regular passes at attack the fronts?
I've had a lot of success attack the safety that's out of position. You'll have a 3 & out or two, but it only takes one lethal strike.
It prevents every pass from being 100% on the money. It allows for a few WTF Matt Cassel like throws. It forces people to set their feet and not rocket everything. No it's not perfect, but it beats the alternative IMO.
Here are the passing leaders in the ACC user OD. Wake Forest @bluejay13 is completing 78%, @Akecheta is at 72% and I'm at 70%.
View attachment 2146
High and Outside seems to be the only way guided passes arent fucked. Or lobbing when you should bullet and bullet when you should lob
It's close to being some borderline BS. I'm done with this argument.
Agree to disagree because it looks past the LOS to me.
I love when people bitch about screens cause what are you spose to do when they blitz every down
I call very few screens but see 9 man boxes all game. There are other solutions that are honestly less risky if you know what you're doing.
That being said, EA made the screens damn near impossible to stop (along with the Texas and Bench concepts).
Lame lobby heads do that all game with ORE, TA&M and Ohio St....then they mix in read option, audible to 5 wide just to scramble and bunch formations....Found something I can add to my spread attack in Madden kind of like the ole Miss or Auburn play 4 verts slide protect the line to the side of the back hot route the back to a wheel sprint out to that side an read the flat defender if he stays with the back pull it down an run if he comes up throw it over his head to the back
I didn't say it was hard but it's lame playing someone who does 5 plays all game.... Not saying you're one of them usually all of that goes together.... I know lobby is lobby but that's where I see what you described alot....If that's all there doing its easy to stop but I don't see nothing wrong with mixing it in
I assume Shula met with some spread coaches over the years, but that offense looks completely different to what he used in Tuscaloosa. He ran mostly zone from one back. Now, he's pulling guards like crazy.
What are the best of the gun H-back formations?
I know there's Normal offset weak, Normal flex wing offset and weak, normal wing offset and weak, wing-trips offset and weak, and wing trio offset and weak. Which are the most effective passing and running? Which do y'all favor?
I'm pretty much doing the same thing! I'm running IZ/OZ/ read with QB power, Wrap, Blast etc.. My passing game is identical also! I'm in love with stick and mix that and the others you have in with levels and smash@TXHusker05 mad thorough. I'm trying to get away from being so triple option focused and develop more of a passing game and rely on a downhill run. I'm thinking IZ, OZ, counter, ZR, and then QB blast, power, and wrap. Basing my passing game on stick, flood, smash, and cross.
So right now I've been brainstorming and rough drafting a playbook that's mostly inline gun 10 and 11 personnel with a couple 12 personnel sets and then corresponding pistol sets. But I love wing trips offset (pistol) and as I've recruited a bunch of tight ends I want to include some H-back stuff.
Trying to marry what I perceive as Air Raid and H-back concepts for a sophisticated but not over-complicated big-body spread.
I'm also trying to get away from being so two-back focused and use more one-back.
Definitely going to include Empty Wing trio. Thinking I need another empty set with it. Empty TE trips or Empty spread or quads. Idk
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What I have written down right now:
Pistol: full house, strong, strong slot, weak slot, ace, twins, twin tight slot, trips, wing trips offset, y trips, trips 4-wide, spread
Gun: ace, twins, twin te slot, normal, normal wk, normal Y-flex, spread, spread flex, spread flex weak, trips, trips weak, trips open, wing trips offset
I could probably add normal flex wing weak and normal offset weak, and wing trio offset.
I just don't want to neuter my passing options because of additions of certain running foils. I definitely like jet and PA jet. So many options in seeking philosophic purity while using a lot of formations.